Hip-hop and breakbeat production?

[qJesse]

I was wondering if anyone knew how to get a good foot up on these two genres? I've been working around 80-120bpm a lot lately (complete switch from when I was doing 140-160bpm all the bucking time), so I figured I'd try to learn more about some of the genres I grew up with.

I know there may very well be plenty of tutorials and lessons out there about both of them, but I figured I'd see if this wonderful community knew anything about them first. There's a lot of talk on dubstep, electro, and other popular electronic genres, which made me hesitate at first, but I figure there's no harm in asking...right? RIGHT?! EH?!?!1

And just to point out; I'm not a fan of most rappers out there, what with their similar lyrics of sexual themes and all. I've just always loved the production behind the words...

[Gray Ham]

Okay, let's see.

In most cases, Hip-Hop can be broken into two categories, modern and olskool.
Most of the stuff on the radio falls under modern, which usually has acoustic guitar, piano, strings, synth, etc. I don't listen to it too much, so I can't really think of any good examples off of the top of my head.
Olskool is my favourite, and the type I listen to non-stop (I don't know if it's just me, but Olskool always has a type of funk to it). Some examples would be here (this one is an instrumental) and here (this one has rap).

The downside to Olskool it almost always has a TON of sampling.

Well, that was confusingly rant-ish.

[prettiestPony]

To amplify on Gray Ham's distinction, new-school hip hop--at least the stuff on the radio, I don't know what's going on in the "underground"--tends to be a bit more up-tempo, often has some classic trance-style supersaw synths (and chord progressions), and is more likely to have "electronic"-sounding drums. (For that last, I mean either drums that were taken straight from an 808/909 or that otherwise have a really unnatural sound to them.) For example, Nicki Minaj - Super Bass is on the fast side--126 BPM I think--, has a classic "drum machine" bass drum and clap sound, and has a syncopated descending synth that wouldn't be out of place in a trance track from 10 years ago. (I don't mean the main "clinky" sounding synth, I mean the one that's kinda in the background. You can hear it coming in at 2:36 in the bridge; also note that the bridge starts off with a stream of 16th notes of a synth, with a short decay and modulated/automated filter... again, somewhat trance-esque.)

Here's another example: Kanye West, Kid Cudi, and Rihanna- All of the Lights is faster and has a pretty pronounced "electronic sound", when it isn't emphasizing the brass parts. (Though it doesn't really have any "trance" elements.)

On the other hand, we still see things like this: Eminem - Not Afraid. Doesn't really have any of the elements I've mentioned before (other than a trance-like chord progression), but it's not really old school. *Shrug*

Actually, there are probably several different new "styles" that are showing up in contemporary mainstream hip hop. I think the most consistent element is the more obvious reliance on synthesizers and drum machines. (Of course, we saw a ton of drum machine usage in the 80s and early 90s too, though. I dunno.)

[qJesse]

Most of the stuff on the radio falls under modern, which usually has acoustic guitar, piano, strings, synth, etc. I don't listen to it too much, so I can't really think of any good examples off of the top of my head.
Olskool is my favourite, and the type I listen to non-stop (I don't know if it's just me, but Olskool always has a type of funk to it).

Same way; I was never into the modern hip-hop, olskool is where it's always been at for me. Sorry for not being specific about which style I wanted, it's not easy to stay focused at 2am. The two examples you provided are perfect for what I'm aiming for, though. (:

So where exactly would I start with Olskool? I'm not completely new to music, so you probably don't have to summarize anything for me, I just kinda need "directions". Sampling would probably be a challenge, but I'm up for it.

And thank you for the information prettiestPony! Even though it wasn't what I was looking for, it's always best to get all the info on anything, especially when I'm hoping to be a mutli-genre artist. ^^

[[voodoopony]]

The old school sound mainly involves old, chopped drum samples. I'd be very careful using midi, it's so perfect and has that gross DAW sound.
Try listening to dudes like J Dilla, Madvillian, Quasimoto, older Dj Shadow, Boards of Canada, Gang Starr, etc for observation and ideas as to where to go next. There really is no particular way to make or start old school hiphop... it's just hiphop, but older, over all!

[colortwelve]

The old school sound mainly involves old, chopped drum samples. I'd be very careful using midi, it's so perfect and has that gross DAW sound.
Try listening to dudes like J Dilla, Madvillian, Quasimoto, older Dj Shadow, Boards of Canada, Gang Starr, etc for observation and ideas as to where to go next. There really is no particular way to make or start old school hiphop... it's just hiphop, but older, over all!

Boards of Canada are really, really good at percussion. And everything else, but I've learned a good bit of the way I do percussion from listening to them.

(I just realized that his comment was pretty much just an excuse to plug BoC and quote Voodoo )

[prettiestPony]

Well, glad to help, even if it wasn't quite what you were going for.

I think the key to old school hip hop is, like others were saying, using samples and more acoustic-sounding drums. If you haven't before, you might check out some hip hop producers you like at www.whosampled.com, to see what their sample sources were.

Breakbeats (I assume you mean things along the lines of The Prodigy, Chemical Brothers, Propellerheads, and The Crystal Method?) also sample from old records a lot. They'll usually layer several different drum beats on top of one another, plus some hard-hitting programmed beats on top of that. On that topic, you should definitely watch this remake of The Prodigy's "Smack My Bitch Up".

[qJesse]

I think the key to old school hip hop is, like others were saying, using samples and more acoustic-sounding drums. If you haven't before, you might check out some hip hop producers you like at http://www.whosampled.com, to see what their sample sources were.

Breakbeats (I assume you mean things along the lines of The Prodigy, Chemical Brothers, Propellerheads, and The Crystal Method?) also sample from old records a lot. They'll usually layer several different drum beats on top of one another, plus some hard-hitting programmed beats on top of that. On that topic, you should definitely watch this remake of The Prodigy's "Smack My Bitch Up".

Both of those sources helped ENORMOUSLY, especially Whosampled. I never thought I would see someone break down the samples of Hideki Naganuma, but man people on that site seem to know a LOT. I now have a pretty good idea on what to do, though it'll take some time and practice. I can't thank you enough, man. <3

p.s sorry for a late reply, life's been busy

[prettiestPony]

You mean I done good? ^.^



Again, glad to help! <3