How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Nine Volt » 16 Dec 2012 17:53

I certainly would love to be a mod, considering how active I am here and how much I want this place to flourish as a hub of music production :3
But I have no idea of the requirements and I'm sure there are more qualified people out there
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby BeaM » 16 Dec 2012 18:10

This. I've been on this site since around January this year and I have yet to produce. A. Single. Song.

I try to make songs and stuff but I get stuck somewhere around the sound design/melodies phase of it. I'm trying to dedicate my life to music but it's hard to do :P
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Omegastick » 16 Dec 2012 18:11

Anyone mind me adding my thoughts on the topic.

As I'm sure most of you know, I'm not the most active member of this forum. Hell, I bet most of you don't even know who I am (though you've probably seen one of my posts somewhere). So a bit about me first to put things in perspective. Music is all I do. I get up, go to college, come back, music, sleep, repeat. Be it listening to or making music (or, as of late, DJing) I am almost always doing music. It's got to the point where my coursework is pretty seriously affected because all I do is music. So you can't say I'm not dedicated to music.

The thing is, I don't make brony music. Now, Navron, this probably annoys and offends you, but I browse the forum anyway. The reason I do this is because I really enjoy reading and discussing production technique. Even if it's stuff that isn't helpful to me, I like to do it anyway. I like to think that I contribute to the forum (AFAIK I've only made one off-topic post ever), but I'm pretty biased, so I hope I'm not one of the people that is ruining the forum.

Anyways, on to what I think we should do about getting proper musical discussion and advice going (because, lets face it, the majority of advice you're going to get on this forum is bad simply because of all the people giving said advice who have no idea what they're doing). A Skype would be good, but I think it would lead to tightly knit cliques that would push out newbies (which are necessary for the forum to grow, whether we like it or not). Perhaps we give out a higher status (not like a mod, just a title or something) to people that have proven themselves to know their stuff about production and can give good advice (I'm talking Lavender, Ralm, Kyoga).

What do you guys think of that?

EDIT:
BeaM wrote:This. I've been on this site since around January this year and I have yet to produce. A. Single. Song.

I try to make songs and stuff but I get stuck somewhere around the sound design/melodies phase of it. I'm trying to dedicate my life to music but it's hard to do :P


May I make a suggestion. Spend an hour a day on a new song. Make time every day for that. Also, don't stop your hour a day until the song is finished. It'll suck, you've got to bear that in mind, but it'll be better than not having anything at all. When I'm stuck in a creative block I open up Ableton and just start making synths and basses and any sounds I can think of. Sometimes it takes me a few days before I get something I'm content with but it happens eventually.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Nine Volt » 16 Dec 2012 18:18

I think you're underestimating the rest of the forum. Kyoga, Ralm, and Lavender aren't the only ones who know stuff about music. I'm not saying I'm better than them (I'm certainly not), but let's not act like the rest of us are noobs who need to be told how to do everything.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby soultensionbenjamin » 16 Dec 2012 18:36

I'll be honest i have lost my passion for making music,mainly because i feel so limited at this point in my life Iv always wanted to recreate,remix,design tunes and ideas but sometimes i just get depressed because i cant work with the sounds/equipment i want to work with in music it's infuriating and its a buzz kill.But am I 100 percent dedicated to music? "I would say yes" It is true I feel like I'm at my lowest low right now but when the universe /god smiles upon me once again I'll be able to get some better libraries/ equipment/ midi interfaces/schooling so i apologize for my lack of work ethnic when it comes to creating more music,im just not in the best situation financially right now.Oh I also take full blame for posting to much in community and asking noob questions on technique .I apologize.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Dr_Dissonance » 16 Dec 2012 18:47

Yeah, I come to MLR for the techniques forum mainly. I only give critique out if someone pm's me about it now.
That being said, the Skype chat was atrocious. I was in there without saying a word for months because I thought maybe someone orchestral might want help someday. But that day never came, so I gave up and left.
It was just filled with things like arguing, completely random things, or my personal favourite:
X Ponyhugs Y
X Ponyhugs Z
X Ponyhugs A
X Ponyhugs B
X Ponyhugs C
X Ponyhugs D
X Ponyhugs E
...
...
Y Ponyhugs X

It baffled me that no-one understood the concept of the word 'everyone' on there. I'd browse through about 200 new messages in the morning on Skype and half of them would be that.
So yeah, I left. If anyone does want feedback/critique, they're welcome to pm me about it.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby itroitnyah » 16 Dec 2012 19:10

If you go onto a group musician chat and expect it to be related about music, or to find help with music, you're going to have a bad time.

Well, except for the #bronymusic chat, to a slight degree. @z0r8 sometimes helps me out on there when I go to ask for critique. Maybe a few other people too. But mostly it's bartekko goofing off.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Navron » 16 Dec 2012 19:26

@itroitnyah, BeaM, and soultensionbenjamin:

All of you post less than 2 posts per day on average. There's a big difference between lurking the site to read up on topics, and thinking the site is a social network.

If this were any other music production forum, anybody posting a vague or off-topic reply to a serious question of production would likely get banned, or at the least, their reply deleted.

Somebody asking a serious question shouldn't have to wade through 30+ replies to see the 3 good replies that directly relate to the question.

If you go onto a group musician chat and expect it to be related about music, or to find help with music, you're going to have a bad time.


That's the attitude a lot of people seem to think, that the main MLR chat is there for musicians to goof off and post non-music related things. A complete opposite of what the chat was designed for, which was to provide a musician to get real time advice on various music topics, feedback on WiPs, etc.

The name of the chat is: MLR Official Music Discussion Chat, and if some people would take the time to read the rules, here's a nice little example:

3) The chat is for music discussion. Silliness is tolerated lightly, but if you want to talk about unrelated things, please seek another chat room.


The main MLR chat is not your megaskype. It's not for endless ponyhugs, roleplaying, etc.

Those things are fine if nothing is going on, but when people are asking legitimate questions and/or trying to get feedback, and they're being ignored, then there's a problem.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby the4thImpulse » 16 Dec 2012 19:36

Steering it back to the OP again.
Navron wrote:Also, I'm not trying to get into a pissing match. If anything, the feedback issue was more of what prompted the thread in the first place, and that's when I noticed that there's A LOT of people active on the forums that don't seem that interested in discussing music.


I completely stopped visiting the music section, its been inundated with new members (under 20 posts) and I almost never received any sort of reply after giving feedback. I also rarely get the feedback I'm looking for on my own stuff in the music section, Its rarely at all constructive if any.

Maybe if the admin here makes a rule where you can not start threads in the music section until you reach a set post count (let them respond to threads but not start them). Combine that with more of a crackdown on spam and useless chatter threads like "the real names thread" from the mods (which we need more of).

I think there either needs to be a subforum for spam and the 'worthless chatter' or NO thread at all for spam of any kind, leave in in skype groups or go to another brony forum. I would rather there be none at all but it seems that the community subforum is for worthless chatter.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby soultensionbenjamin » 16 Dec 2012 19:41

(sorry to get off topic) but for stuff like the role playing and goofing off to much. warn the perpetrators and if they continue kick them from the group.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Nine Volt » 16 Dec 2012 19:41

Navron wrote:@itroitnyah, BeaM, and soultensionbenjamin:
If this were any other music production forum, anybody posting a vague or off-topic reply to a serious question of production would likely get banned, or at the least, their reply deleted.

Somebody asking a serious question shouldn't have to wade through 30+ replies to see the 3 good replies that directly relate to the question.

I'm going to have to politely disagree with the first statement. Deleting the reply, yes probably (and fairly), but being banned for one off-topic or vague reply? Seems to be a bit of disproportionate retribution. If the poster has a history of it, maybe, but not for one-timers.

The second statement, yes, I fully agree with. Topics should remain on topic, if people want to post off topic things, the spam thread is sitting in Community. It's there for that kind of stuff.

I don't go on Skype though, so I can't really comment on the chat... but if people with legit questions are being ignored in favor of roleplaying or just fucking around... something's not right there.

the4thImpulse wrote:Maybe if the admin here makes a rule where you can not start threads in the music section until you reach a set post count (let them respond to threads but not start them). Combine that with more of a crackdown on spam and useless chatter threads like "the real names thread" from the mods (which we need more of).

I think there either needs to be a subforum for spam and the 'worthless chatter' or NO thread at all for spam of any kind, leave in in skype groups or go to another brony forum. I would rather there be none at all but it seems that the community subforum is for worthless chatter.

I'd just like to point out that the community forum is specifically for
Sports, politics, movies, videogames, questionable hobbies, photos from your family vacation, etc. Talk about stuff! But do try to stay on topic.
Not intending any disrespect, but there is nothing on there about discussing music. I'd be perfectly fine with a subforum designated for specifically topics of that nature though.

With regards to the music thing, the set post count could be a good idea, I'd support it.

And yes, we still need more mods.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby itroitnyah » 16 Dec 2012 19:42

Navron wrote:@itroitnyah, BeaM, and soultensionbenjamin:

All of you post less than 2 posts per day on average. There's a big difference between lurking the site to read up on topics, and thinking the site is a social network.
Assuming I was always active since the day I joined...

No, When I first started, I would come on here once a week or so for about 2-3 days in a row. Then just a few months, like 2-3, after joining MLR, I left for a long period of time, about a month or two. And it wasn't until this school year started that I began to get really active. That was when I got my school netbook and could come on here frequently pretty much wherever I was. So I've only been truly active for about 3 months now. But depending on the traffic on this site, I generally make about 4-6 posts a day, and that's on a slow day. On days where there are posts like these, it averages out to about 10+. The reason I don't average 20+ posts like Nine Volt does is because I don't go onto the spam thread :P

But I would, in no way, just consider myself a "lurker". The lurkers would be the ones who just sit and read the posts, not really doing anything. I guess.

Navron wrote:Somebody asking a serious question shouldn't have to wade through 30+ replies to see the 3 good replies that directly relate to the question.


I strongly agree with this. Which routes us back to the problem of, MLR needs more mods.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby the4thImpulse » 16 Dec 2012 20:12

Nine Volt wrote:Not intending any disrespect, but there is nothing on there about discussing music. I'd be perfectly fine with a subforum designated for specifically topics of that nature though.

With regards to the music thing, the set post count could be a good idea, I'd support it.

And yes, we still need more mods.

I personally have a lot of trouble with language skills so I know people will take what I write the wrong way sometimes so let me try to explain that better. The community thread is for discussions, I know that and I don't want to change that. But, there are a lot of off topics posts in many of those threads, sometimes I really don't see the need for a certain thread but that's not for me to judge.

To be absolutely clear, the community section has a lot of the off topic/spamy stuff we are all sick of here. If a thread is about your favorite car that's not the place to show off your favorite pony meme and leave the thread derailed. IMO there's a lot of chat threads that don't serve much purpose in helping the music community grow for the better, if anything its only helped grow the 'chat room' habits that have leaked out all across the board.

I hope that makes better sense, if not please ignore what I have wrote on that specific subject.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Nine Volt » 16 Dec 2012 20:16

the4thImpulse wrote:
Nine Volt wrote:Not intending any disrespect, but there is nothing on there about discussing music. I'd be perfectly fine with a subforum designated for specifically topics of that nature though.

With regards to the music thing, the set post count could be a good idea, I'd support it.

And yes, we still need more mods.

I personally have a lot of trouble with language skills so I know people will take what I write the wrong way sometimes so let me try to explain that better. The community thread is for discussions, I know that and I don't want to change that. But, there are a lot of off topics posts in many of those threads, sometimes I really don't see the need for a certain thread but that's not for me to judge.

To be absolutely clear, the community section has a lot of the off topic/spamy stuff we are all sick of here. If a thread is about your favorite car that's not the place to show off your favorite pony meme and leave the thread derailed. IMO there's a lot of chat threads that don't serve much purpose in helping the music community grow for the better, if anything its only helped grow the 'chat room' habits that have leaked out all across the board.

I hope that makes better sense, if not please ignore what I have wrote on that specific subject.


Ah, that makes more sense. Yes, I strongly agree that the threads should remain on topic, I misunderstood your previous statement. I thought you were saying that all the threads on MLR should be about music
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Motivfs » 16 Dec 2012 21:39

Been keeping an eye at this thread while at work all day, finally home and able to give my opinion...

Firstly, I do post alot on the Spam thread, yes, it is what it is, a SPAM THREAD. I post on there because I like to let off the stress from actually working on a song, and have lately been getting music block ALOT which I have now finally been shedding away. I say this because I imagine since I post on there alot, you have coined me as one of the "problems" with this site, but I'll leave that until I get a response I won't dwell further into it.

I have only been on this site for over 4 months now, and the one thing I see this site lack the most is feedback as stated above. I have always wanted feedback so badly, but I am a very condensed person and, yes, I do post my WIPS, but still, I do not directly ask people for help because I would imagine most would not help me or are too busy with others things, so I leave it to the music forum (dead at that) to hope that someone replies with some constructive critique.

Am I dedicated? You bet your ass I am, I have just spent loads of money on a new computer, JUST for production and not one bit for gaming. I have spent countless dollars on VSTS, programs, and soon a legitimate sound system to actually attempt to mix with since I cannot drive a car. I put as much as possible into music production and I work 5 days a week, and still plan to save up and go to school. I might not have posted that many songs on MLR, but that's because I am a perfectionist. The only problem is, I cannot find perfect without another opinion (once again pointing at your feedback rant Navron).

Feedback is without a doubt the most valuable thing you could get in my opinion, and I have barely ever gotten it, I feel all alone most of the time, so I've tried to make friends on this site.

On one last note, ANYONE who thinks new people, very new people at that should not even bother being on this site are wrong. I think every person, new or not, tons of experience or no experience deserve the same treatment. If you think otherwise, please leave, I think that is such a poor attitude to have. I have no experience in Piano, Guitar, or singing unlike most people, and yet I try my hardest to make the most of the skills I have (4 years of percussion) and I truly feel like an underdog, so I can see where they are coming from.

I would love to offer my own feedback, but I still feel I lack so many key elements that I am scared to give them the wrong idea, which is why I stay away sometimes about posting what I think, unless it's what I know.

Anyways, I know I swayed all over the board here, but that's my 2 cents.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby LoreRD » 16 Dec 2012 23:43

I guess I'm more of a lurker on this forum. While I'm online quite often, I mostly just read the topics I'm following at that moment (like this one),), and don't always bother posting. I occasionally post in the spam thread (which is MEANT to draw RP/off-topic-ness away from other topics). I suppose this could be considered "lazy", but I rarely find that I can contribute in a meaningful way, especially when people with way more experience than me have already posted to those topics. If I have questions, I usually ask specific people via Skype.

I also find that unless I'm talking about piano/drum technique, I don't have enough confidence in my abilities to adequately critique something (once again, especially if it's given to someone who's more experienced). That, and the sheer amount of music posted, has kept me away from the "Music" subforum for quite a while.

I also strongly dislike the sentiment that you have to be entirely dedicated to music or you quit music. Brian May has a Ph. D in Astrophysics, for example. Music is a major focus for me (I play three instruments regularly, compose music during a large portion of my free time, listen to music all the time, and talk to a lot of musician friends), but I don't intend (at least not right now) to make a career out of it. I make music because it's fun, I love music, and it improves my skill at composing/producing music. That does not mean I don't take my music seriously, though. I put in as much effort as I feel I'm able to put into it.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Navron » 16 Dec 2012 23:55

To clear things up:

- I have nothing against the spam thread.
- I have nothing against new musicians.
- I am not advocating severe punishments for people who post a less than helpful reply on serious discussions. Just using that as a comparison, to illustrate that on many other production forums, that kind of behavior is punished very harshly.

The problem with the forum is people don't stick to the community section, and they don't stick to the spam thread. Many times a topic will have a somewhat on-topic response that ends up splitting into several off-topic responses. Typically these are somewhat forgivable, because you can see how the topic evolved, and where the people replying got confused, but it's still a situation that shouldn't have happened in the first place.

- In other words: If you're simply posting an opinion on a technique topic, without having some level of knowledge on the topic discussed, don't post. If the topic has no replies, refer the OP to a person knowledgeable that can help them.

The other side of it, is sometimes people just post gibberish, such as dolan references, bad english, and occasionally nothing coherent at all, on serious threads with somebody looking for advice. That kind of behavior is unacceptable.

As for new musicians, I've got nothing against them, however, I'm sick of seeing questions asked that have been asked many times before, or questions that can be answered using the MLR Music Guide and/or a simple Google search.

This is what I mean when I say, "hand-holding a new musician." It's a sign of laziness, lack of dedication, and IMO, they don't deserve anybody helping them out.

We've all been in the new musician category. There's a certain level of headache, frustration, etc. that comes with it. The only difference is some people acknowledge the steep learning curve, and push themselves through it, while others sit in their comfort zone, and expect others to help them get over the next hurdle.

Using music theory as an example, if somebody asks if their song sounds good, and you tell them, "You should use this key instead of what you got here, because the one you have doesn't fit in any progression," you'd be pretty ticked off if they then asked, "Well, which notes should I use for the new key?"

Had an actual experience based around that example. When asked what notes were in the key, I said, "Just do a search on google and you'll find out which notes they are," in which they replied, "Well, I think I'll just stick to what I've got."

What exactly am I doing? I'm providing feedback to help them out, and they show they have absolutely no desire to push themselves outside their own comfort zone.

My job here is to have fun, better myself as a musician, and help others become better musicians as well. That doesn't mean I'm going to give a lecture on music theory, or tell someone exactly what to do, step-for-step, to create a better song. At least some level of dedication and effort is required on their part, which links in with the title of this thread.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Motivfs » 17 Dec 2012 00:12

I hope you know that my rant against people not supporting new musicians was not at you Navron, as I saw your point, I was replying to the thread in general, and any responses in general. In case you are replying to me.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Elmorya » 17 Dec 2012 02:19

Im pretty new to MLR and Forums in general. I've only had my software for about 9 months now and I decided about 3 months ago that I would actually want to make music a my career. That being said I was still at school and have only had about a month to actually experiment and try to find my own sound.

I said all that so I could say that I do, in fact take music seriously, the problem is that I have no musical direction at the moment so it makes it difficult to give feedback and such on genres I don't feel I know much about. I don't think i've been here long enough to talk about how things used to be but to me it just doesn't really seem like the people take music seriously here. This is a generalization, so nobody take offence because I read through almost every post on this thread and I can see it's not the case for you guys.

Another thing is that I feel like I have a pretty good ear for music. I used to rap so i can help people with writing lyrics, and I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I can usually recommend changed to people's songs. However, whenever I try to give advice I don't get any kind of response back so i just figure they didn't listen to what I had to say anyways. I would be more than willing to help new musicians and people who just need an outside opinion, however I'm still not sure I know enough about the technical side of music to make those kinds of suggestions =/
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Orange » 17 Dec 2012 10:01

Lurker here. I look at the site every day, check for new posts in Technique and Sharing is Magic and usually leave after. I see a few good threads which can help, though they seem to be less and less common. Generally I communicate with like-minded musicians through Skype. I could help out more, post some more, but when I get the chance, I'm often more worried about improving my own skill as a musician than trying to help others. Just throwing out an alternate point of view here, as I'm sure there are plenty like me on these forums.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby KillerAmp » 17 Dec 2012 14:59

I have to say, i've been working at my music for awhile now, and i know im going to be dedicating my life to it, as either a singer, producer, drummer, or a combination of them. Sadly i can not say that this is the best place for critique, because as 4th and others said, theres a lot of new people pushing out a track they made in an hour, waiting for feedback, and never giving it to others. I almost abandoned this forum, if it wasnt for the technique section, basically because of the fact that it really seems like a majority of the people posting in Music are newer and havn't really gotten a grasp on quality. Im not trying to insult anyone, as i know there are plenty of people on these forums who are spectacular, and i could only wish to be at their level of perfection.
I feel like this forum has gotten off ratio, as there are more people looking for help, than there are who can provide it.

the best tips i can give to any new people are
1. Look into Music Theory
and 2. Read your manuals, and practice
no forum will instantly make you good at music, after just reading posts.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Freewave » 17 Dec 2012 17:41

I think this is a smart topic to discuss. Clearly MLR is still having a lot of issues in trying to be a good music training ground when people are apathetic to pitching and posting relevant responses or ignoring older threads on the same topics that have been covered again and again. I just don't see a lot of people wanting to give back to this forum (look at the venting/ hugging thread which is ALL about venting now). Clearly Lavendar is right that people NEED to use that report button when people are using spam and off-topic posts. We do need more mods (Navron, 4th impulse would be great at it) but Makkon needs to actually act on that. I also recommended music discussion subforums to increase discussion on music in general but never saw any movement or feedback on it. There are a lot of people here who are dedicated to music but who will never be professional musicians, that's not because they aren't dedicated, it's because they realize the scope of what they want their music to be or who they are in life. But there are a lot of people here that don't want to make good music, to learn and grow, or understand music to a better degree and that's a shame and their presence is not that helpful tbh if that's their attitude. If people haven't even bothered to view youtube tutorials on their DAW and want our help teaching them the very basics it's as much a waste of their time as it ours. We shouldn't be babysitting young musicians. We need to expect that people can use MLR searches on old topics and things like google and youtube to help themselves first.
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Freewave
 
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Foxtrot89 » 17 Dec 2012 19:52

It's the nature of art. People all want their stuff to be seen but quickly overlook others who want the same thing. It quickly becomes a vicious cycle. This has been my experience on the 4-5 art communities I've been to. Every now and again I try to give feedback, which gets met with defensive snarky "it's supposed to be that way" remarks and it's discouraging. I still come back here every now and again for the few helpful gems that pop up and the fact that I'm actually able to give some noobish folks some advice. The world of music is just one discouragement after the other, but you can always find slivers of good things mixed in with all the garbage.

As far as dedication, I've been steadily learning and buying things to further myself in the field. I'm dedicated to finding enjoyment in music and production. The fact that I push on through the mountains of discouragement is proof of that.
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby KillerAmp » 17 Dec 2012 20:34

I agree with all this stuff, and i apologise for the times i had messed up with adding threads to the discussion. But i am a serious musician, and i feel i got past the basics through reading manuals and watching tutorials and experimentation. The issue with the modern MLR is that so many new people join and only kind of want to make music, or they "want" to make music, but really they want it to be a "can't i just push a button and have dubstep???" kind of path. I feel, along side everyone else on this thread, that MLR has declined. I know the mods, (Lavender, Makkon, Ect.) are trying, and i hope they continue to. But just my point of view; it seems now that MLR has strayed from a music production forum, to a Music/General Discussion forum, with a side of music production.
I wish all the best, and that it will come back up, ill still lurk the technique forum for those 'gems' like Foxtrot89 mentioned!
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KillerAmp
 
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Re: How many of you are actually dedicated to music?

Postby Mr. Bigglesworth » 17 Dec 2012 20:50

I've been at this for about a year. I'm dedicated to it, I enjoy music more than anything.
I'm not here anymore, but if you want you can still just call me Mr. BigBagelBoggle!

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